Yes ... I agree completely, I'd also add that Confuciusism plays a part in most of East Asia.
Part of these philosophies include that "..the group is more important than the individual.." - we could see that in action when the authorities didn't really have to tell people to wear masks... it's common to see this when someone has a cold or cough or something. Individual freedoms don't apply here.
Good post — you got me thinking with this one, Liv. 🤔
Liberty, egalitarianism and limited government — plus the free-market capitalism and meritocratic systems such ideals have fostered here in America — still require (a) the rule of law and (b) the will of the people to prevail.
Citizens of and visitors to the US (or any country for that matter) enter into explicit and implicit social contracts to abide by laws and customs, with both bottom-up social shaming and top-down law enforcement acting to protect the “good parts” of society.
I agree with you that moving toward the Japanese social model stifles too much liberty to be a global optimum (but that cleanliness and orderliness sure is soothing balm for me, lol). That said, social shaming is a lever that could be used more effectively, especially in our US justice system (your talk with Magatte Wade explored some great alternatives to building in social accountability over incarceration).
IMO, the answer has to come through technological innovations of two kinds: (1) provide such outrageous levels of abundance for everyone such that scrabbling for resources becomes passé and (2) guardrail us from our own collective foibles, such that everyone becomes properly incentivized to do the “good” or “right” thing in any situation (enter drone-slapping, etc.).
But until then, the main problem I see today is that increasing numbers of people are not as apt to see the systems our nation has built, and the laws that protect them, as “good”. Many people seem disillusioned enough with the current systems to openly want to tear them down — be it a junkie in SF, or Soros, or many sitting members of Congress and the judiciary, and countless others from the bottom to the top. I am not a mind reader, of course, but their actions certainly seem to indicate this is in fact happening.
Ostensibly, I can only guess that the folks at “the top” must be purposely allowing rule of law to decay here in the US, fanning the flames of unrest through media, defunding/vilifying law enforcement, and halting prosecution of crime. There must be some end-game, which is clearly optimizing for something other than the constructive social progress you are getting at — at the core, probably good ol’ money and power. Whether it’s to drive down commercial real estate prices so they can scoop it up for pennies on the dollar before “cleaning up the streets” in heroic fashion and making trillions in the process, or whether it’s to bring perceived social injustices to a head such that they can no longer be ignored, or whether it’s to break down the status quo to be rebuilt in their image.. who knows? Certainly not me. But the incentives are in all the wrong places, that’s for sure, because fewer and fewer people seem to give a damn about sacrificing a little in their own lives so that we can all have a lot together.
Wouldn’t it be grand to grow our abundance to such a point we could overcome the treachery of our own species, with super-intelligent and (mostly) benevolent AI “adults” in the room as Iain M. Banks laid out in his books? And the drug glands might help things get along, too. ;)
Alas. In centuries’ time…
Keep the content coming — good stuff! We all need to be thinking about this more if we are to find next-generation solutions. I am grateful folks like you are doing this work.
Whatever you’re on, I need some, Liv.
The big one for me is: female emancipation without births collapse, and vice versa. From every angle I find it irreconcilable.
As a female former hikkokomori now flawed terminally online mother of 1…. Matrescence is hard as f***
Thanks for your liberated direction of optimism
Yes ... I agree completely, I'd also add that Confuciusism plays a part in most of East Asia.
Part of these philosophies include that "..the group is more important than the individual.." - we could see that in action when the authorities didn't really have to tell people to wear masks... it's common to see this when someone has a cold or cough or something. Individual freedoms don't apply here.
Good post — you got me thinking with this one, Liv. 🤔
Liberty, egalitarianism and limited government — plus the free-market capitalism and meritocratic systems such ideals have fostered here in America — still require (a) the rule of law and (b) the will of the people to prevail.
Citizens of and visitors to the US (or any country for that matter) enter into explicit and implicit social contracts to abide by laws and customs, with both bottom-up social shaming and top-down law enforcement acting to protect the “good parts” of society.
I agree with you that moving toward the Japanese social model stifles too much liberty to be a global optimum (but that cleanliness and orderliness sure is soothing balm for me, lol). That said, social shaming is a lever that could be used more effectively, especially in our US justice system (your talk with Magatte Wade explored some great alternatives to building in social accountability over incarceration).
IMO, the answer has to come through technological innovations of two kinds: (1) provide such outrageous levels of abundance for everyone such that scrabbling for resources becomes passé and (2) guardrail us from our own collective foibles, such that everyone becomes properly incentivized to do the “good” or “right” thing in any situation (enter drone-slapping, etc.).
But until then, the main problem I see today is that increasing numbers of people are not as apt to see the systems our nation has built, and the laws that protect them, as “good”. Many people seem disillusioned enough with the current systems to openly want to tear them down — be it a junkie in SF, or Soros, or many sitting members of Congress and the judiciary, and countless others from the bottom to the top. I am not a mind reader, of course, but their actions certainly seem to indicate this is in fact happening.
Ostensibly, I can only guess that the folks at “the top” must be purposely allowing rule of law to decay here in the US, fanning the flames of unrest through media, defunding/vilifying law enforcement, and halting prosecution of crime. There must be some end-game, which is clearly optimizing for something other than the constructive social progress you are getting at — at the core, probably good ol’ money and power. Whether it’s to drive down commercial real estate prices so they can scoop it up for pennies on the dollar before “cleaning up the streets” in heroic fashion and making trillions in the process, or whether it’s to bring perceived social injustices to a head such that they can no longer be ignored, or whether it’s to break down the status quo to be rebuilt in their image.. who knows? Certainly not me. But the incentives are in all the wrong places, that’s for sure, because fewer and fewer people seem to give a damn about sacrificing a little in their own lives so that we can all have a lot together.
Wouldn’t it be grand to grow our abundance to such a point we could overcome the treachery of our own species, with super-intelligent and (mostly) benevolent AI “adults” in the room as Iain M. Banks laid out in his books? And the drug glands might help things get along, too. ;)
Alas. In centuries’ time…
Keep the content coming — good stuff! We all need to be thinking about this more if we are to find next-generation solutions. I am grateful folks like you are doing this work.
Economics are a part of it too imo
Only country to have collective capitalism, how to have true competition?