What a great list! As a businessman who has made a living creating win-wins, I’ve always believed the trick is to align incentives - as once that is accomplished, no collaboration is required.
Hello Liv, thank you for sharing this. I really enjoy the mindfulness and narrative you're bringing with these principles - and your journey to find more win-win context. These certainly give life to that endeavor. I'll be curious to see how you embody these principles, and how they inform win-win concepts/inventions you propagate.
I'm curious how to integrate these principles into a game, or into a lived collaboration. I feel like this list would help screen culture of existing games for win-win mindsets, and I could see the value of identifying examples of where they are seen and not seen. What kind of things benefit from a scoring system? (aka; not love, but yes to diminished externalities). When in games/life are we most likely going to face an opportunity to "grow the pie" vs shrink it, and how can we be mindful of those moments for ourselves and others?
I feel there may be a hidden root or incentive to win-lose strategy like "ego" or "fear", but I'm uncertain if that's the whole picture. It would be cool to expand this a bit more, and once a satisfying spread of rationale are outlined for why win-lose mindset is gravitated towards; re-screen though the principles and see if there's a sentiment that would help anyone struggling with them transform to the win-win strategy.
I can imagine some skits that emphasize these principles in action becoming trendy, and help to further "show" how they might root in reality. I hope this helps to stir up ideas. I'm excited to see where you'll be able to take this.
Liv, what a super list. I've enjoyed coming across your work this last week, it comes at the same issues I spend alot of time thinking about but from a very different lens. I've read a few of your substacks and caught a few podcasts. The ideas you discuss are very cool in relation to human/human interactions, I am wondering how you see your thought models applying to our more than human interactions? One of my primary lenses is as a regenerative farmer and I'll admit I really struggled with the resource implications of your utopias/distopias episode. I enjoyed the mental gymnastics of the thought games but from my perspective we are playing these games in a very finite box that is being pushed very close to limits. I'd love your thoughts on how we play win-win games with nature. I think regenerative farming is an example, it does not require the massive energy and fossil input of industrial farming, allows farm animals more dignified lives and contributes to the repair of eco systems, while allowing us to reap sustenance in return. I guess secretly I harbour fears about our ability to scale such systems to provide for all of us - perhaps that is just my scarcity training! I'd love your thoughts! xo
Thanks Gillian, and apologies for the slow reply, I missed this comment somehow! You raise an important question - planetary boundaries are often dismissed, or in many cases outright ignored in techno-optimist discussions. Regarding win-win games with nature, I very much agree regenerative agriculture seems essential, alongside cultured meat and other high energy efficiency/low landuse food tech to ensure that sufficient calories are produced. Can you elaborate on which specific methods you're focussed on, or share any good reading resources? I'm fairly new to this topic.
Hey Liv, no worries about the slow reply, the digital avalanche is alot! I’ve been involved with permaculture ideas and Holistic grazing for decades but had not thought to apply the win-win lens until your podcast. I don’t have any specific resources to suggest at this point but you have reminded me this is a space I would like to explore more - I will ping you a link when I do. Thank you for your work!
I agree with the spirit of this and buy-in to 2-10. Unfortunately, principle 1 is not supported by the facts. That may be fixed by replacing “the universe “ with “society”. Also, let’s be humble: what do we really know about the universe as a whole? That is not where our experience plays out
Thank you. As a mediator focused on resolving win-lose and finding win-win this is a helpful framing. Distill it to purposeful engagement in good faith to create better outcomes and old conflicts come into new focus.
Am excelllent list! And yes, Goodheart's Law should be taught in schools - first to the teachers and administratora! I used to quote it frequently as an academic during discussion about assessment and standards, and now I've moved into tech, I quote it whenever people start wittering about KPIs.
Such a thought-provoking list, thank you for this! #4's take on love being "the power to empower others" resonates so much. And #7 sounds like contract negotiation: working together to achieve a deal you both want, but every little compromise or assertion in the "fine print" has an effect on who benefits in the end, or whether the deal falls apart entirely.
I'm also interested in concepts such as why lose-lose is sometimes desirable, when the game is to exhaust the resources of the other side before yours are, in the pursuit of some future win.
What a great, encouraging read to start the day sipping coffee. #4 rocks.
What a great list! As a businessman who has made a living creating win-wins, I’ve always believed the trick is to align incentives - as once that is accomplished, no collaboration is required.
thanks! What win-wins have you created? would love to hear more
It’s a James Carse Infinite Game innit
Hello Liv, thank you for sharing this. I really enjoy the mindfulness and narrative you're bringing with these principles - and your journey to find more win-win context. These certainly give life to that endeavor. I'll be curious to see how you embody these principles, and how they inform win-win concepts/inventions you propagate.
I'm curious how to integrate these principles into a game, or into a lived collaboration. I feel like this list would help screen culture of existing games for win-win mindsets, and I could see the value of identifying examples of where they are seen and not seen. What kind of things benefit from a scoring system? (aka; not love, but yes to diminished externalities). When in games/life are we most likely going to face an opportunity to "grow the pie" vs shrink it, and how can we be mindful of those moments for ourselves and others?
I feel there may be a hidden root or incentive to win-lose strategy like "ego" or "fear", but I'm uncertain if that's the whole picture. It would be cool to expand this a bit more, and once a satisfying spread of rationale are outlined for why win-lose mindset is gravitated towards; re-screen though the principles and see if there's a sentiment that would help anyone struggling with them transform to the win-win strategy.
I can imagine some skits that emphasize these principles in action becoming trendy, and help to further "show" how they might root in reality. I hope this helps to stir up ideas. I'm excited to see where you'll be able to take this.
Liv, what a super list. I've enjoyed coming across your work this last week, it comes at the same issues I spend alot of time thinking about but from a very different lens. I've read a few of your substacks and caught a few podcasts. The ideas you discuss are very cool in relation to human/human interactions, I am wondering how you see your thought models applying to our more than human interactions? One of my primary lenses is as a regenerative farmer and I'll admit I really struggled with the resource implications of your utopias/distopias episode. I enjoyed the mental gymnastics of the thought games but from my perspective we are playing these games in a very finite box that is being pushed very close to limits. I'd love your thoughts on how we play win-win games with nature. I think regenerative farming is an example, it does not require the massive energy and fossil input of industrial farming, allows farm animals more dignified lives and contributes to the repair of eco systems, while allowing us to reap sustenance in return. I guess secretly I harbour fears about our ability to scale such systems to provide for all of us - perhaps that is just my scarcity training! I'd love your thoughts! xo
Thanks Gillian, and apologies for the slow reply, I missed this comment somehow! You raise an important question - planetary boundaries are often dismissed, or in many cases outright ignored in techno-optimist discussions. Regarding win-win games with nature, I very much agree regenerative agriculture seems essential, alongside cultured meat and other high energy efficiency/low landuse food tech to ensure that sufficient calories are produced. Can you elaborate on which specific methods you're focussed on, or share any good reading resources? I'm fairly new to this topic.
Hey Liv, no worries about the slow reply, the digital avalanche is alot! I’ve been involved with permaculture ideas and Holistic grazing for decades but had not thought to apply the win-win lens until your podcast. I don’t have any specific resources to suggest at this point but you have reminded me this is a space I would like to explore more - I will ping you a link when I do. Thank you for your work!
I agree with the spirit of this and buy-in to 2-10. Unfortunately, principle 1 is not supported by the facts. That may be fixed by replacing “the universe “ with “society”. Also, let’s be humble: what do we really know about the universe as a whole? That is not where our experience plays out
Thank you. As a mediator focused on resolving win-lose and finding win-win this is a helpful framing. Distill it to purposeful engagement in good faith to create better outcomes and old conflicts come into new focus.
Do you think games are an intrinsic property of the universe? Some inevitable emergent outcome of interactions between agents?
Am excelllent list! And yes, Goodheart's Law should be taught in schools - first to the teachers and administratora! I used to quote it frequently as an academic during discussion about assessment and standards, and now I've moved into tech, I quote it whenever people start wittering about KPIs.
Such a thought-provoking list, thank you for this! #4's take on love being "the power to empower others" resonates so much. And #7 sounds like contract negotiation: working together to achieve a deal you both want, but every little compromise or assertion in the "fine print" has an effect on who benefits in the end, or whether the deal falls apart entirely.
I'm also interested in concepts such as why lose-lose is sometimes desirable, when the game is to exhaust the resources of the other side before yours are, in the pursuit of some future win.